GM's MLTL with 416-8B

[westend9]

Greets!

You're welcome!

No, I missed the 'step' in the cutout.

Not really, just stick some thick enough felt or similar pads on the 'steps' to snug it up.

At 16+ ft^3, a couple of 10ths off either way isn't audible.

I guess not other than I don't see any provision for easy vent tuning. It's location is fine.

Yes, this is my insulation of choice same as Altec after the asbestos laced Celotex was outlawed. Many manufacturers, DIYers use polyfil and the material properties MJK uses in his software with lamb's wool being considered the Rolls Royce of speaker damping.

Then there's open cell foam now that they've learned how to keep it from dissolving over time. I've experimented with open cell sleeping pad since it's so cheap at the local Wal-Mart, K-Mart, Cloth World or similar 'big box' discount stores. No doubt there's other materials out there and seems to me I read something awhile back about 'green' ground up T-shirts or jeans or some-such, so with each of these having radically different damping coefficients, you would have to experiment to find the optimum amount.

Just don't use closed cell foam..........

GM

Thanks, I feel like I'm on the right path with the bracing, cabinet volume, and such.

The linked Pensil 12 cabinet literature states, "Adding this bracing can be as much work as the whole rest of the cabinet but really helps to get the last bit of performance..." and I can agree with work assessment, I just drilled 42 --9/16" holes in one brace and had to stop to let the drill cool off.

I will weigh my options on the type of stuffing to use. If I can source the 703 sheet fiberglass, that would probably be my first choice.

I don't mind recutting the vent to a larger size or adding vent length should that be necesary. I may want to do some cosmetic treatment to the outside of the cabinet so covering part of the vent, also, would not be that big of a deal.

I am thinking of building a frame to aid in the assembly of the cabinet. Maybe a square of 1 x 4 with slots cut in two pieces so that squareness can be adjusted and dimension changed to accomodate any discrepancies of the cut panels. I think I have all the dimensions correct....

Thanks, again for your time with this.

[Altec Best]

West, Looks like your moving right along ! :2thumbsup: :coffeedrinker:

[GM]

You're welcome!

Yeah, and why I used individual scrap pieces and 'wired' them together. Much easier, quicker for me.

OC 703 or similar (AKA duct board) is made primarily for insulating heating/AC ducts, so at least in my locale can usually be bought from an installer; or in my case I lucked up and scored a pick-up truck full of 2x2 ft squares of it for the cost of hauling it away from a local installer that had a large, specialized contract go sour.

Another time I cruised past a different installer and got a bunch of large sheets of it with aluminum foil backing out of their dumpster, large enough to give me a ~ lifetime supply of replacement under hood insulation liners. Wire, in my experience, it can be bought by the pound for just a little more than scrap value from a reclaimer.

Again, an adjustable picture framing jig is all you need. You can make it using four store bought clamps or routing out blocks of wood mounted up on an old interior door left at curbside. Now you're ready to 'rock n' roll' with just a couple of sawhorses for 'peanuts'.

GM

[westend9]

You're welcome!

Yeah, and why I used individual scrap pieces and 'wired' them together. Much easier, quicker for me.

OC 703 or similar (AKA duct board) is made primarily for insulating heating/AC ducts, so at least in my locale can usually be bought from an installer; or in my case I lucked up and scored a pick-up truck full of 2x2 ft squares of it for the cost of hauling it away from a local installer that had a large, specialized contract go sour.

Another time I cruised past a different installer and got a bunch of large sheets of it with aluminum foil backing out of their dumpster, large enough to give me a ~ lifetime supply of replacement under hood insulation liners. Wire, in my experience, it can be bought by the pound for just a little more than scrap value from a reclaimer.

Again, an adjustable picture framing jig is all you need. You can make it using four store bought clamps or routing out blocks of wood mounted up on an old interior door left at curbside. Now you're ready to 'rock n' roll' with just a couple of sawhorses for 'peanuts'.

GM

My soul is singing and everything seems right in the world when I discover that I am not the only recycler/reclaimer on the planet. The stuff that is landfilled in this country is unforgivable, IMO. My main occupation is in the construction field and we are noted for landfilling a large percentage of materials, estimated 15% of what is brought on site is disposed of for a residence. This week, I reclaimed two aluminum 8' gear rack sides and associated hardware. I will certainly focus my recycling efforts on the HVAC crews for the duct insulation because of your descriptions.

The door use is just about what I had in mind, something to offer a jig for panel assembly because the panels are so large. I have a lot of lumber around and many clamps so I could build an assembly jig with no material outlay.

I am finishing up on the center braces and will post up some pictures of the finished braces when complete.

Edit: Well that was one task that was easier than I had assumed. I bought some new blades for the Bosch jig saw and had at it. I routed all of the edges except the woofer cradle with a 3/8" roundover bit and gave it a quick sanding. The layout and templating took twice as long as the actual task, lol.



I am now considering what I will do by way of a jig for assembly. The snow is just about gone so my stacks of boards are appearing in the back fourty. FWIW, GM, I still have a couple of thousand feet of 1 x 8 redwood plank that was once a fence around a McDonald's parking lot. They had half the parking lot full of the fence when I arrived and a quick question to the manager and the fence became mine.

[westend9]

Made a couple of clamping jigs to ease the assembly procedure, nothing fancy, some scrap I had from this and other projects.
I started the glue-up with the side panel braces. I'm using Garret-Wade's 202-GF glue on recommedation from my BIL, the furniture builder.

[westend9]

I glued five sides of the first speaker and the braces in, today. The small clamping jigs I made worked out well. I had two snafu's: the center brace was too long, I took the measurement of the length from the wrong panel, I guess. A saw fixed that. Also, I nearly premanently glued in the bottom hatch. Luckily, I remembered that I had spread glue on the center brace where it meets the bottom panel. I unscrewed the hatch and set it aside.
I filled all the joints where the panels meet with PL400 construction adhesive. No air leaks in this cab.
Tomorrow, I will get some stuffing in the cab and glue on the front.

[GM]

I'm using Garret-Wade's 202-GF glue on recommedation from my BIL, the furniture builder.

Interesting, wasn't aware of a glue with such properties. Will come in handy for a couple of furniture repairs I need to do.

Thanks!

GM

[westend9]

Yeah, there's a few of us around, though probably the world's majority reside in Japan. Like many of my generation, I was raised to be a recycler up to a point, but when I became aware of what they were doing at the J.A. Pan, Co. back in '66, it really 'lit a fire under me' on the subject.

Only 15%?! That's really low compared to my locale, though in the past decade it's gotten better. Until legislation makes it a huge finable offense that gets tacked on to property taxes if they fail to recycle, the average American isn't going to bother. Heck, around here if you want the city or county trash collectors to pick-up recyclables you have to pay via property tax assessment for the privilege even though they get paid by the reclaimers!

I really wonder why I bother though. I mean just one illegal alien or otherwise 'indifferent' family around me dumps more recyclable paper, cardboard, glass, plastic at the curb for trash pick-up in a week than I reclaim in a couple of months and there's many thousands of them in a ~5 mi. radius.

Looks nice, but I swoon at the thought of spending so much time on woodworking I can't see. Different strokes............

A Mickey D's with a Redwood fence?! Don't recall ever seeing such a luxury at any 'fast food' emporium around here. The only Redwood I've scored is [7] 1x8x96" rough sawn planks that's been collecting dust in the shop for right at 34 yrs now. Now that I know I'm probably stuck where I am till I'm good as gone, guess I ought to use it up on that fireplace I'd considered way back when now that firewood, as expensive as it is now, is cheaper than electrical or natural gas heat around here.

GM

You're absolutely right on all of this, GM, it seems like a drop in the bucket (the recycling efforts) when you look at what others pitch to be land filled and the leaders of our communities, for the most part, make some of it ridiculously difficult. I look at recycling as both a personal mandate due to my past activities and as an economical alternative. Who knows, maybe some of it wears off on others and that couldn't be a bad thing.

The detail in the cabinet construction also falls under the "personal mandate" thing, as well, I guess. If nothing else, it helps hone my woodworking skills.

The McDonalds fence was certainly a windfall, it's nearly impossible to find clear Redwood at any lumber yard around here. If it can be found, the price is very high. There was nothing wrong with the fence other than the paint was peeling from it and I'm guessing the bid from a painting contractor to repaint it determined the outcome. If you have some good plank, consider it an heirloom, lol.

Interesting, wasn't aware of a glue with such properties. Will come in handy for a couple of furniture repairs I need to do.

Thanks!

GM

Yes, my BIL swears by this adhesive and for the little time I've used it, it seems to have excellent adhesion and strength. An inadvertent placement of a clamping spacer and glue squeeze-out combined to make for quite a bit of tugging to release the clamping block. I would say it is quite similar to Titebond III but has more solids in the mix. When I filled my quart glue bottle from his gallon container, we had to mix the settled solids from the bottom of the gallon container.

I was out and about, this morning, looking for sheet fiberglass but couldn't come up with any. A learned employee at one of the lumber super-stores told me that Owens Corning will only distribute it through their distributor network and won't sell any to the generic super-stores. I picked up a roll of R-13 and thinking that it was what was in the original Model 19's and might be a good substitute. If it doesn't meet the requirements, I'll pull it out and put in something else in the future. I'm planning on placing the insulation behind the woofer on the back panel, 1/3 down from the top, across the top panel, and on the side panels, down the same 1/3. This is the current plan unless I hear different from you. I might peel a little fiberglass off so that the dimension is reduced from the 3 1/2" standard to about 2" or so. That is YTBD. Let me know what you think on this because I have no idea about densities and such.
Thanks, again, for your time and knowledge.

Edit: Thinking of how I could incorporate a bit of our shared recycling interest in this, I present: The hatch guide rails, made from the aforementioned McDonalds fence.

[westend9]

Some more progress was made, last night. I stapled the R-13 fiberglass into the cabinet, installed foam srtips on the driver cradle, attached the front panel, and felted the bottom hatch cover.
There was a little problem with fitment between the front panel and the rest of the carcass. I had installed a T-nut in the channel for the center brace and a dry-fit showed some interference. The Dozuki made the necesary small cut in the center brace for clearance. Another dry-fit and this time the front panel passed the paper-won't-slide-under-starightedge test. It is sure a good feeling when the last panel falls in place with a resounding thump!
Earlier, I had promised pictues of a large number of clamps being used and here it is:











I will attach the 416 in a little bit to make sure everything fits up well and then remove it for the finishing process. Before finishing, I'll launch into assembling the second cab.

GM, do you think the R-13 is going to make the grade or should I immediately remove it in favor of the 703 style? I'm pretty sure I can get that style of sheet fiberglass but not on the weekend. The R-13 wouldn't go to waste since I use it for other construction jobs.

[GM]

My soul is singing and everything seems right in the world when I discover that I am not the only recycler/reclaimer on the planet.

Yeah, there's a few of us around, though probably the world's majority reside in Japan. Like many of my generation, I was raised to be a recycler up to a point, but when I became aware of what they were doing at the J.A. Pan, Co. back in '66, it really 'lit a fire under me' on the subject.

Only 15%?! That's really low compared to my locale, though in the past decade it's gotten better. Until legislation makes it a huge finable offense that gets tacked on to property taxes if they fail to recycle, the average American isn't going to bother. Heck, around here if you want the city or county trash collectors to pick-up recyclables you have to pay via property tax assessment for the privilege even though they get paid by the reclaimers!

I really wonder why I bother though. I mean just one illegal alien or otherwise 'indifferent' family around me dumps more recyclable paper, cardboard, glass, plastic at the curb for trash pick-up in a week than I reclaim in a couple of months and there's many thousands of them in a ~5 mi. radius.

Looks nice, but I swoon at the thought of spending so much time on woodworking I can't see. Different strokes............

A Mickey D's with a Redwood fence?! Don't recall ever seeing such a luxury at any 'fast food' emporium around here. The only Redwood I've scored is [7] 1x8x96" rough sawn planks that's been collecting dust in the shop for right at 34 yrs now. Now that I know I'm probably stuck where I am till I'm good as gone, guess I ought to use it up on that fireplace I'd considered way back when now that firewood, as expensive as it is now, is cheaper than electrical or natural gas heat around here.

GM